The Lions' Pride

And I have agreed that this is a negative for Penn State. It would be nice if Joe could travel and visit recruits in their home. I stated that above in my post. Unfortunately he does not. My stance is that I would prefer to have him as the HC than to not have him, regardless of that.

Sneaky Pete you don't need to continue to mention that Joe is old and he is 84 and he is not as active as he used to be. No crap! Anyone can see that. That doesn't make him irrelevent. That doesn't make him some piece of crap who damages the program,.

He doesn't travel to visit recruits the way he used to. Get over it. And your comment regarding a back-up plan for the parents, etc. means nothing. How many coaches in D1 programs make it more than 4 years at the same school? I would be willing to bet that the majority of college grads do not have the same HC or position coach all four years. Recruits should be picking a 4-year school for more than the HC. The decision should include facilities, EDUCATION, comfort level with location, support, etc. I would like to believe that recruits who consider PSU would understand that the replacement for Joe will continue with the same morals. Besides, why would you want Joe visiting recruits and naming a replacement because you want him gone now. You should be happy he doesn't talk to recruits.

Wow, really???

What facts have you presented??? Our record against top tier teams. If all you care about is winning then I don't think you have any clue what Penn State is all about. Winning is great but molding STUDENT athletes into responsible adults is what really matters. We don't break promises made to recruits by oversigning, we run one of the cleanest programs in the country, and we are at the top of the list for graduating athletes. With all that we still contend with the top teams in the country occasionally and like I previously stated made a run at a National Championship a few years ago. Your opinion is great and I can see what your saying but I do not agree. No where did you provide a fact that he is hurting our program. He has stated why he no longer goes out and visits recruits and you chose not to believe him. I can say I know players and coaches and they said this or that but that would not sway your opinion because it would be coming from a guy on an internet message board. Accept the fact that people disagree on things and try not to come off so angry when debating topics.

I prefer to just avoid playing good teams at all. Works for the Boise's and TCU's of the world! How about the fact TCU is joining a BCS conference and their strength of schedule might get weaker! #BIGEASTSUCKS

Everybody is entitled to their own opinion, so they should not be crucified when they express them.
That being said, it seems to me like those with this opinion have lost what it means to be a Nittany Lion. The reason we are such a great program, the reason we are the Penn State that everybody knows and respects, is because of the way we run our program. Graduation rates and a clean program are not a 'spiel,' they are what we have built our entire foundation on. Do you really want us to turn into an Ohio State, or a USC? Where we bring in thugs and idiots, with little to no regard for their university or their team, simply to compete at a higher level? If that is the way you feel, I have absolutely no idea why you are a Penn State fan to begin with, because that is simply not what Joe Paterno, or the university as a whole, is about. While programs like Florida, OSU, Oklahoma, or whoever else ranked in the top ten every year, are winning programs, they are by no means good collegiate athletic programs. They have arrests, citations, or violations every year, and still graduate less than 70% of their players.

In my opinion, what makes Penn State football so great is that we still care about the player and his future outside of football. We are one of the few programs in the entire nation that still puts a strong emphasis on academics before football, and I sincerely hope we never move away from that. The fact that we are still relatively competitive with the programs who recruit those problem players is remarkable, based on our limited recruiting pool and refusal to compensate players unfairly. It is a testament to this staff to even have a winning record, albeit against mediocre competition, with this focus on character over talent.

Success with Honor is a banner that I proudly support. If Penn State were any different I doubt we'd keep the same amount of respect nationwide that we do now.

Just my opinion, however. I don't root for Penn State because we are the greatest team, but the best program. I'd rather have a 7-5 season with a clean program and no violations than a 13-0 record with constant speculation and accusations of foul play by the coaches and players.

But it would have been OK if we won a national championship with those players, right? If we're looking strictly for athletic potential, lets go down to the Florida State Penitentiary and start writing some checks. Sure, they might get arrested every once in a while, but Scout.com will love us, and we'll get all those shiny crystal footballs at seasons end. I mean, you're not a great football program unless you win a championship at least twice a decade, right?

I'm gonna try to put what FJP is saying in different words. Lion, would you be ok with having a 100% graduation rate but losing every game of the season? Probably not. It's obvious from that quote that you wouldn't want success with no honor. The thing is success with honor, and as a huge D1 school, having 1 without the other is a call for a new coach, and as of now we are semi successful with some honor.

I understand that this is the nature of the business of college football. However, our "some honor" is still more than any other program in the country. And its not like we have been horrendous this past decade. True, its been tough going against the OSU's and UM's before RichRod, but we've been very successful in bowl games outside of the Rose Bowl disaster a few years back.

I understand that I am biased, because I love and appreciate Joe for everything he has done for us as a university, but there is a difference between being adamant and being foolish. It is ridiculous to think that a team that hasn't won in 16 seasons can compete year in and year out with these present-day powerhouses.

Some people are okay with mediocrity, some aren't. I'm not. I want to see our football team dominate all opposition, not just the "cupcakes". I want to see us go on the road and upset the #1 team in the nation. I want to see Penn State play in a National Championship. I want to see us play a modern game, a fast, slick, well coached game that we can put up against anyone anywhere and not get to a big game just to get spanked 38-24 when we though we were good.
I'm tired of seeing us crap the bed on the road. I'm tired of seeing us lose to teams with less talent on the field than we have. I'm sick and tired of seeing us out-coached. I don't like seeing us pack it in when we're down 14 with 5 minutes to play, punting on 4th and 2, instead of giving our kids a fighting chance. So tired of playing not to lose when we should be trying to lay a smack down. Tired of the age old excuses and older game plans.
I love Penn State and loved my years I spent there. But the be brutally honest, I don't give a crap about graduation rates really. NCAA makes sure they are academically eligible to some point anyway. We have, and have had good graduation rates in the past and that's fine, but probably only because we hardly send guys to the NFL, they can't afford to leave early because they're not good enough. I wouldn't mind seeing that drop if we consistently put a great team on the field and sent more players to the NFL. That's after all what a large portion of the players want anyway, to play on Sunday. I don't want thugs and criminals on the team or at the university, but we can still be a dominant program again without them. Great teams and thugs do not go hand in hand as some make out. I don't sit there thinking " Well, so and so isn't very good, but at least he's getting a 3.7gpa." I sit there and think he should be subbed out. I'd rather have the 3.0gpa student who's a game changer.
Down vote me if you must, but I'm just being honest. I could sit here and waffle on about graduation rates and the right way and this and that way, but at the end of the day I think we'd all forget about the how's and whys if we were playing in National Championships and winning our Conference Title outright.

I believe your point is that we don't have to settle for the gpa and grad rates when we used to have those plus championships and great seasons. It's as if our coaching staff is either stale, tired or lazy at times. I know that isn't true, at least for all of them. That is proven in recruiting. We all know who produces and who doesn't in general.

The lower your expectations comment was the death knell of the championship expectations for the program. When your leader surrenders the troops don't have much chance at championship success. That said it all for me. In his early years he would have "rededicated himself" as he did several times when things when sour. Now I don't hear that anymore. I hear lower your expectations and grad rates with honor. The Grand Experiment was Success with Honor. Now it is Honor with potential success, occasionally, hopefully, maybe if we get lucky.

There is no way to not see who is behind this, the man who told us to no longer expect success but to lower our expectations. I believe that would have made a great retirement speech quotation but instead it was used as an excuse to explain lack of success.

In any event none of us can change things and the school sees the cash streaming in from the BTN and Big 10 Conference profit sharing system. No need to change anything until they HAVE to. That may not be soon. Sad but true.

Hopefully I am remembering this correctly but an article I read yesterday stated that Penn State is ranked 12th for alumni on NFL rosters. Sounds to me like they are putting a lot of guys into the NFL.

According to him, there are only 15-20 successful programs in all of college football.