The Lions' Pride

JoePa routinely visited players more recently than the last 10-15 years. I know that Moye received an in-school visit from Joe and he wasn't a "big time" recruit of any sort. I think that this practice by Joe has decreased dramatically in the last 3 or 4 years, which makes it a relatively new wrinkle in the lack of HC duties he's performing.

As to the comment about "seeing a few of his practices," I'm assuming you are referring to the televised BTN practices or the like? OF COURSE he's going to be up and moving and interacting with the players when the camera is on him. I have no idea if he's doing that off-screen at reg practices or not, but it's naive to take these few instances and apply them to all practices.

As for the coaches, I agree.

You're right. It is naive to say that. Probably why I said "I have no idea if he's doing that off-screen at reg practices or not" rather than saying he isn't coaching when the cameras are off.

Good reading comprehension.

You said Pryor was more or less the only in house visit in recent times. I stated that I know Moye, for one, received one. I believe there were several others around the time of Moye's commitment to PSU. I'm telling you that only in the last 3 or 4 years has JoePa stopped recruiting outside of state college all together, not in the last 10 or 15 years.

And again, I don't know what the practices are like outside of the taped segments on BTN but how many times have we received mis-information from media/players? Many times. Media and Players are the ones that aided the spread of the JoePa is sick rumors, among others. Those were clearly not completely truthful. They were also responsible for the "Tom Bradley to Pitt is a done deal" rumors. How much truth was there to that 'report'? See what I'm saying?

So what you're telling me is that you only read so far into the post then stopped reading the rest? And doesn't it make sense that any coach, JoePa or otherwise, would "show off" a little while cameras are there? so yes, OF COURSE he'd be up and moving and interacting with players.

Again, I can't help that you didn't read the entire post and jumped to a conclusion.

NO, NO, NO, NO....No I am not just referring to visiting recruits. I am talking about the amount of hours spent at practice, game planning etc....Have you talked to current players? I have. Have you talked to current players parents? I have? Current coaches have sent out hints as well. If you actually think Joe or any other 84 year old man, is physically able to do everything required you are very naive or just unwillingle to admit Joe Paterno has any flaws. FACT, he is not doing all the day to day duties.

Loyal? Hmm, some coaches might say otherwise and thats why they were looking to go elsewhere. Dick Anderson and Galen Hall are both here against their will right now, doing a favor to Joe.

I can see one arhuing to what degree Joe is hurting the program, but, to think he is not hurting it at all is just mind blowing.

Exactly. Imagine what these guys would say if a player or recruit did come out and say something like that. They would all bash the hell out of them....Sadly, no, alot of these apologists are not smart enough to realize these things.

It never ceases to amaze me how many people are at the ready to bash Joe when things don't go well. I believe it has been nearly a decade since the animosity was last at this level. For those of you with short memories we were a last second field goal away from playing for a national championship a few years ago and followed that up with an 11 win season. I didn't hear anyone calling for Joe to go then. As far as recruiting is concerned lets not forget that he had a top ten class last year according to almost all sites.

The idea that he is hurting the program is laughable to me. I enjoy the fact that he is there and believe we will never have another like him. He is going to be a hard act to follow and I hope our program can maintain its integrity after he leaves. He cares about the student aspect of the term student athlete more than any other out there and that can not fall by the wayside. Eventually he will go and lets hope the next in line is as good an all around person as Joe.

psu2005 - get used to it on this site. It is one of the most frustrating things about this site. You cannot talk about any topic without someone trying to bring Joe into it and bash what he is doing at PSU. I tried to take this fight but it is not worth it. The sad part is that when he is gone, I would love to hear from all these people when they realize what is lost. Every point you mention above is valid and I tried as well to list the points you listed. However, everyone will tell you that you are an idiot and Joe sucks, etc.

The "topic" is Joe Paterno and Penn State. So ummmm....why is it that you have a problem with people "bring(ing) Joe into it" and being critical of him?

Joe Paterno is a legend, an icon, a role model. He's done amazing things on and off the field for Penn State and college football at large. I love him as the coach of my alma mater for that. However, that does not mean he is above reproach and criticism. Just b/c someone has been in a job for 40 years doesn't mean they get a free pass to NOT do all the duties associated with the job. One of the duties of a head coach at a Division I school is to actively recruit players and take in-home visits. Joe doesn't do that.

You equate him to a CEO? That's probably valid on some levels but the adequate parallel is acting as the CEO of a Fortune 500 company but completely blowing off a meeting at your major clients/customers' offices to negotiate the next contract. You wouldn't do that as a CEO just as a head coach who is performing all his duties wouldn't ignore recruiting trips.

With the CEO thing, you're missing the point when you talk about the VP's doing the negotiating or whatever. I was just trying to put it in terms of your CEO example. In reality, it just comes down to "what is in the CEO's job description"? If it's in the CEO's job description to assist his VP's to close the deal on a huge contract, then he shouldn't be ignoring these duties. In this case, Joe is ignoring those duties.

And as for the kids "on the fence" tending to sway to the other schools, I would argue that it's BECAUSE we're sending assistants rather than the HC. Sure, JoePa is part of their visits to PSU, as he snould be. So are the head coaches at every other school recruiting them. The difference is that the Head Coaches are ALSO hitting the recruiting trail for their most important recruits. I can just see a recruit thinking "wow, all these HCs are visiting me yet PSU just sends an assistant, what does that say about how 'special' they think I am and how much they care about me."

You can't be serious. Again, 8 of the last 11 seasons have had at least 4 loss's. Have you looked at our record against top 25 teams? How about top 25 teams on the road? How about against OSU? How about against Iowa, or UM? I'll give you a hint, they aren't very good at all. You alos might want to look at the point differential in those games too. We beat up on bad teams anbd get exposed against good teams. We recruit very mediocre and it shows. How many times do opposing coaches state they knew exactly what play we were going to run or what defense we were going to run? How many times has his play calling on boith sides been a major factor in a game? hell, the man made an in game decision this year without knowing where his team was on the field!!! hell, hiring and promoting Jay is all on Joe and hurting the program. But no, he isn't hurting the program at all. Plenty of people were calling for joe to go in those 11 win seasons. We beat mediocre teams and lost to good teams minus 1 game against OSu starting a true frosh at QB, hell they still had a chance to win. Then against OSU the next year we get dominated. What a surprise. We are medicore, meaning we beat teams with less talent and lose to teams with equal to more talent (more often then not)

So, Joe can stay as long as he wants IYO. What if he is in an iron lung? or if he goes blind? What if he can't physically do anything but insists on being HC? Can he still stay IYO? You do realize that PSu doesn't stand for Paterno State University, right?

So, you say:

However, he is very active with recruits and their families when they visit PSU from what I hear. That allows him to spend more time with the players that are interested in visiting PSU, etc. rather than travelling the country to visit 100's of recruits that may not even have the slightest interest in PSU.

A. He traveled and visited recruits for 40+ years. Why stop all of a sudden unless hmm, his health and age are a factor. Also, when Joe stated we were 1 or 2 players away, what did he do? He WENT TO Dwill and JKing. Hmm, maybe because he knows it is an important part of the process.

B. There are VERY FEW days a HC can visit a recruit so the taking time to visit 100's of recruits is a HUGE stretch and non factor cause it never happened, not with any HC. What a HC does, especially one as smart as Joe, is narrow down the most important recruits and the ones on the fence, and visit them. Just like he USED to do.

Maybe PSU has trouble luring kids on the fence because they have an 84 year old HC with no backup plan known and parents and/or recruits want to know what will happen. Odds are against anyone at age 84.