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Yup. Just like you avoided my point on PSU signing the decree under duress. And now choose to ignore what it actually means.
Exactly, what a douche.
Corbett will not be reelected, IMO.
If winning was easy even losers would do it.
Oh I know what it means, but that would have to be proven. I addressed that. I said at this point the signature is on the paper and the burden to prove is that the NCAA forced them to sign it under duress, and prove that they forced the BOT to approve it under the same conditions. I wish the administration would have let them try and hit us with the Death Penalty as there would be a much better challenge since we were not repeat offenders.
I think the executive committee would have still wanted the harsher penalties for the PR. Not that I really disagree with anything you say there.
Just a little background on the sanctions (which we know some of it already), from thib4psu on FOS:
"Just got done reading the book "Free the Nittany Lions! The Amazing Saga of the NCAA & PSU Football" by Keith E. Nelson, prof of psychology at PSU and member of the faculty senate. Apparently on the shelves of stores throughout State College (couldn't find it anywhere here in south Florida). Anyone else read this yet?
Although it's a little disorganized (IMO), there were some nuggets I found that I either forgot or had never heard before regarding the NCAA's sanctions and the "process" by which they were developed.
1. This is the first case of the NCAA bypassing its own Committe on Infractions.
2. Apparently there is no public record available as to who in the NCAA Executive Committee voted "yay" and "nay" to giving Emmert the power to be judge, jury, and executioner. So no one in particular can be held publicly accountable for this unprecedented action.
3. Gene Marsh had quite the track record in keeping multiple violations a U of Alabama stalled and negotiated. In fact there were many people in the 'Bama community that expected death penalty sanctions based on violations from 1998-2010, but Marsh worked to prevent it from happening, and was formally recognized there for this effort.
4. Author draws a comparison between Marsh and the fabled Trojan Horse (PSU was the Trojans and NCAA was the Greeks). PSU must have thought Marsh was something special based on his history with Bama, but his involvement appears to have been disastrous for PSU.
5. A former Chair of the NCAA sanctioning committee (not named in the book) made public comments that this case was way out of the NCAA's jurisdiction, and that multiple past NCAA presidents had stated that this position does NOT have power to independently punish players, coaches, or schools.
I guess I didn't really need the ensuing anger & frustration over the holidays, but it is good to see more detailed critiques of the past year hitting public venues. "
"Whoever’s trying to kill me isn’t getting the job done. But one day, I’m going to punch that f___r in the face."
I disagree..By the time they would be done investigating (2-3-4 years? Going on year 2 or 3 for Miami), the fallout would be 1/100th of what it was a week after the Freeh Report. Heck, it wasnt even a couple months after the Freeh report did the constant bad talk tone down and some started coming out of the woodworks saying the sanctions were BS and that the Freeh report was not what many people thought it was (because they didnt read it before saying stupid sh*t)
Also to add onto that...PSU would've been going through the recommended changes from the Freeh Report, trials wouldve played out, and so forth. So to sanction us as harshly 2 or 3 years down the road would be even more nuts.
This post has been edited 2 times, most recently by tmaluchnik 18 months ago
Can't say I disagree with you there. I just think this lawsuit is a step in the right direction.
There was no way this was going to drag on and on though. The NCAA wanted to get out in front of this because of the PR and the public outrage. Miami and all that is a horse of a different color. You can beat your mother, steal from the school, cheat on your wife, rape women, take classes for kids, and hand them envelopes full of hundred dollar bills, and the public will forgive you and/or the institution very quickly (relatively).
You mess with kids and there's even a hint of covering it up, they won't forget that shit or let you live it down soon.
This post was edited by tmaluchnik 18 months ago
Could the NCAA really prevent it from dragging on? If Erickson didn't sign the consent decree, didn't Emmert say it would go through the infractions committee and the death penalty would be on the table? I don't see how they could have expedited this process. PSU could still appeal the ruling. Hence the reason they had to threaten Erickson to sign it.
Couple of points:
1). The BOT has never formally voted to accept either the Freeh report or the sanctions. They talked about, but a motion for a vote was never made.
2). Its a bit of a grey area, but Erickson probably didn't have the authority to sign the consnet decree, without the approval of the BOT, given the amt of money involved.
3). Erickson said PSU was threatened with the death penalty, Ray and Emmert say no. Someone is lying or being weasely with words. "Oh, we weren't talking about actually killing Rod, just shutting down his football program". IMO, Erickson was most certainly coerced.
IMO, the next move hinges on what actually happened in 1998 and 2001. Who was told what when. Once these facts are known, the Freeh report can be affirmed or refuted. These facts may become known during criminal proceedings, or, if aquitted, C/S/S may choose to reveal details outside of court.
Its a house of cards. If the Freeh reported is refuted, then the BOT can say that they never voted to accept the sanctions, and that Erickson signed illegally. In concept, the BOT could sue Erickson for overstepping his authority, or Emmert/NCAA for accepting Ericksons signature when they knew he didn't have the authority to sign. Emmert and Ray were university presidents, one could argue that they knew a university pres didn't have the power to sign such a decree.
So yah, put me firmly in the camp that says the C/S/S trials are crucial for the future of PSU football.
Eh,they can expedite it still I think. They would have easily found a way to get it through the ringer. They would hvae stopped everything else. They were pushing for that to get through as fast as possible. If anything it woul dhvae came, at latest, around this time now. And personally I would rather have had it done last summer than now to get it over with. That's all just imo though.
Yeah, then they give us the death penalty and we have a legit chance at fighting it as we are not repeat offenders (one of a few in major college football).
Considering they just threw their rule book out the window to punish us, they would probably came up with something. I see the benefit of getting the punishment over with, but I still would rather have seen them fight it. It seems like the legal experts and former infraction committee members where on our side before this whole consent degree BS happened.
I agree with the last part. But the same legal experts, including th eones who came to PSU said that it would be practically impossible for PSU to force the NCAA to change its sanctions because of that clause. They all agreed they over stepped, ridiculously in fact, but its hard to beat those things. they have held up so well in court.
"They allowed him in practices and games after they knew there was an investigation into his actions. That can be a violation of an ethic clause for them allowing them to sanction Penn State."
I really doubt that this is true.
Innocent until proven guilty and all that.
It would be pretty hard to restrict/rescind a retirement agreement based on a "secret" grand jury investigation. Sandusky had not been arrested or charged until last November. If PSU had acted, and Sandusky was not guilty, then I believe Sandusky would have grounds to sue PSU.
"People ask me why I stayed here so long, Look around, Look around, I stay here because I love you all" R.I.P. Joe - 12/21/1926-01/22/2012
You can easily suspend those rights until a conclusion the investigation has been met. That would have been for cause. Of course they also knew about that investigation since they were all being interviewed. Also, the NCAA does not have to worry about the legality of the issue just their definition of ethical standards.
6 News @WJACTV
Gov. Corbett has set a Wednesday press conference in State College to announce a lawsuit against the NCAA regarding PSU sanctions.
If I had to guess I would say it is to keep the fine money is PA but I guess we can always hope for more.
This post was edited by PSUJT0409 18 months ago
Dominate The State
The timing of this really intrests me. Would love to know the motives that drive it. So many questions!
-What took so long?
-What aspect of sanctions are they fighting?
-Is it ploy to help keep BOB from leaving?
-Is it ploy to help get Corbett relected?
-Is this just a way to keep Kathleen Kane busy so she doesn't uncover Corbetts secrets?
-How much does Kathleen Kane play a role in this decison?
-Does the Gov. know that the case against C/S/S is weak and he wants to get the ball rolling & put serious pressure on the NCAA?
-Is it simply that the state reps are pissed at Emmret?
He saw his poll numbers.
Thank God!! Someone with more testosterone then estrogen. Didn't mean to insult you ladies, but don't you perfer us men to act like men.
Pete Thamel @SIPeteThamel
Gov's office being vague on suit, but it's expected to combat all NCAA sanctions against PSU. Not just use of $60 million fine.
Now that would truly be ground breaking and absolutely huge.
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